Saeed Amen, author of “Trading Thalesians: What the Ancient World Can Teach Us About Trading Today”, discusses the past, present and future of FX trading.
One of the first things people want to know when they meet Saeed Amen, Co-Founder and Consulting Quant for The Thalesians, is: what does Thalesians mean?
The puzzling name refers to the Greek philosopher, Thales of Miletus, the first options trader.
Mythology has it that after becoming fed up with being ridiculed for being an impractical philosopher, an occupation suited only for poverty, Thales made a fortune by forecasting a good olive harvest and cornering the press market.
“I’ve been working in markets for 10 years, and it was a natural extension to write about I’d seen, but at the same time, I wanted to have a spin on it,” said Amen. “I didn’t know too much about the ancient world before I started the book, so it was a good opportunity to find out what’s happened in history.”
Amen’s decade in the financial industry includes working in major investment banks like Nomura and Morgan Stanley, but his most memorable experience may have been watching Lehman Brothers implode from the inside as a young quant strategist.
Risk has been transferred from sell side to buy side in Execution
That catastrophe served as a catalyst to start the Thalesians, along with his colleagues Paul Bilokon, currently a director at Deutsche Bank, and Matthew Dixon, currently an academic in Chicago.
“We were trying to work out what went wrong, so we started The Thalesians seminars, and it built up into a big community,” said Amen. The Meetup group has just over 1,800 members with branches in London, New York, San Francisco and Budapest.
It’s also grown into a research and consultancy with an office in Level39, a fintech hub in London’s financial district, Canary Wharf, and Amen is a regular commentator on the markets for major media outlets.
And just as looking back at ancient wisdom can teach us about how we got here, and where we might be going, so too can speculating about the future. The next big thing in Institutional FX, said Amen, is going to be in the execution space.
“It’s not going to be the case that you are just going to a broker and get a price for your $1 billion order because banks will charge you, they can’t take as much risk as they used to,” said Amen.
A few years ago, most orders were manual but things are changing: ticket sizes are going lower, more and more is being transacted on electronic platforms, and it costs more for the buy side to get prices in big sizes. In other words, execution risk is going up.
When buy side uses trading algorithms, there’s no way of knowing what the price will be at the end of the fill. It’s a whole new way of thinking from going to a broker and getting a price up front, Amen noted.
It also means buy side will need to manage and optimize execution risk: “That part’s (about) going to the right venue, what type of execution algorithms you are using, and whether your bank’s giving you the best Liquidity .”
“Risk has been transferred from sell side to buy side in execution,” said Amen. “There’s also a lot more scrutiny of this as well in terms of best execution, there’s regulatory pressure to make sure buy side get the best price.”
One of the first things people want to know when they meet Saeed Amen, Co-Founder and Consulting Quant for The Thalesians, is: what does Thalesians mean?
The puzzling name refers to the Greek philosopher, Thales of Miletus, the first options trader.
Mythology has it that after becoming fed up with being ridiculed for being an impractical philosopher, an occupation suited only for poverty, Thales made a fortune by forecasting a good olive harvest and cornering the press market.
“I’ve been working in markets for 10 years, and it was a natural extension to write about I’d seen, but at the same time, I wanted to have a spin on it,” said Amen. “I didn’t know too much about the ancient world before I started the book, so it was a good opportunity to find out what’s happened in history.”
Amen’s decade in the financial industry includes working in major investment banks like Nomura and Morgan Stanley, but his most memorable experience may have been watching Lehman Brothers implode from the inside as a young quant strategist.
Risk has been transferred from sell side to buy side in Execution
That catastrophe served as a catalyst to start the Thalesians, along with his colleagues Paul Bilokon, currently a director at Deutsche Bank, and Matthew Dixon, currently an academic in Chicago.
“We were trying to work out what went wrong, so we started The Thalesians seminars, and it built up into a big community,” said Amen. The Meetup group has just over 1,800 members with branches in London, New York, San Francisco and Budapest.
It’s also grown into a research and consultancy with an office in Level39, a fintech hub in London’s financial district, Canary Wharf, and Amen is a regular commentator on the markets for major media outlets.
And just as looking back at ancient wisdom can teach us about how we got here, and where we might be going, so too can speculating about the future. The next big thing in Institutional FX, said Amen, is going to be in the execution space.
“It’s not going to be the case that you are just going to a broker and get a price for your $1 billion order because banks will charge you, they can’t take as much risk as they used to,” said Amen.
A few years ago, most orders were manual but things are changing: ticket sizes are going lower, more and more is being transacted on electronic platforms, and it costs more for the buy side to get prices in big sizes. In other words, execution risk is going up.
When buy side uses trading algorithms, there’s no way of knowing what the price will be at the end of the fill. It’s a whole new way of thinking from going to a broker and getting a price up front, Amen noted.
It also means buy side will need to manage and optimize execution risk: “That part’s (about) going to the right venue, what type of execution algorithms you are using, and whether your bank’s giving you the best Liquidity .”
“Risk has been transferred from sell side to buy side in execution,” said Amen. “There’s also a lot more scrutiny of this as well in terms of best execution, there’s regulatory pressure to make sure buy side get the best price.”
EU Parliament Imposes €10,000 Cash Payment Limit in New Anti-money Laundering Legislation
Network, Learn, Grow | FMAS:24
Network, Learn, Grow | FMAS:24
Get ready to mark your calendars for FMAS:24, returning this May! Take a quick glimpse of what awaits at the Sandton Convention Centre in Sandton, South Africa from May 20-22, 2024.
Don't miss out on this 5-second invite packed with energy and urgency!
Secure your free ticket now 🔗 https://events.financemagnates.com/yQx0l?utm_source=youtube&utm_campaign=fmas-is-back&utm_medium=video&RefId=FMAS24+Video+Ad+%5B1%5D
#fmas24 #fmas #fmevents #financeinafrica #traders #investors #affiliates #forexTraders #investmentOpportunities #B2BNetworking #finTech #Innovations #TradingCommunity #BusinessOpportunities #AfricanBusiness #Johannesburg #southafrica
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Get ready to mark your calendars for FMAS:24, returning this May! Take a quick glimpse of what awaits at the Sandton Convention Centre in Sandton, South Africa from May 20-22, 2024.
Don't miss out on this 5-second invite packed with energy and urgency!
Secure your free ticket now 🔗 https://events.financemagnates.com/yQx0l?utm_source=youtube&utm_campaign=fmas-is-back&utm_medium=video&RefId=FMAS24+Video+Ad+%5B1%5D
#fmas24 #fmas #fmevents #financeinafrica #traders #investors #affiliates #forexTraders #investmentOpportunities #B2BNetworking #finTech #Innovations #TradingCommunity #BusinessOpportunities #AfricanBusiness #Johannesburg #southafrica
📣 Stay updated with the latest in finance and trading!
Follow FMevents across our social media platforms for news, insights, and event updates. Connect with us today:
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Here's a sneak peek into the FMAS:24 vibrant atmosphere! Join us at Africa’s premium financial event for a transformative experience that combines the best of finance and technology.
From May 20-22, 2024, the Sandton Convention Centre in Sandton, South Africa, will be the hub for over 3,500 attendees to engage in unparalleled networking opportunities, learn from over 150 industry-leading speakers, and explore innovations from 120+ exhibitors.
Secure your free ticket now 🔗 https://events.financemagnates.com/yQx0l?utm_source=youtube&utm_campaign=fmas-is-back&utm_medium=video&RefId=FMAS24+Video+Ad+%5B1%5D
#fmas24 #fmas #fmevents #financeinafrica #traders #investors #affiliates #forexTraders #investmentOpportunities #B2BNetworking #finTech #Innovations #TradingCommunity #BusinessOpportunities #AfricanBusiness #Johannesburg #southafrica
📣 Stay updated with the latest in finance and trading!
Follow FMevents across our social media platforms for news, insights, and event updates. Connect with us today:
🔗 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/showcase/financemagnates-events/
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Don't miss out on our latest videos, interviews, and event coverage. Subscribe to our YouTube channel for more!
Here's a sneak peek into the FMAS:24 vibrant atmosphere! Join us at Africa’s premium financial event for a transformative experience that combines the best of finance and technology.
From May 20-22, 2024, the Sandton Convention Centre in Sandton, South Africa, will be the hub for over 3,500 attendees to engage in unparalleled networking opportunities, learn from over 150 industry-leading speakers, and explore innovations from 120+ exhibitors.
Secure your free ticket now 🔗 https://events.financemagnates.com/yQx0l?utm_source=youtube&utm_campaign=fmas-is-back&utm_medium=video&RefId=FMAS24+Video+Ad+%5B1%5D
#fmas24 #fmas #fmevents #financeinafrica #traders #investors #affiliates #forexTraders #investmentOpportunities #B2BNetworking #finTech #Innovations #TradingCommunity #BusinessOpportunities #AfricanBusiness #Johannesburg #southafrica
📣 Stay updated with the latest in finance and trading!
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Join 3500+ Attendees at FMAS:24 | Africa's Premium Financial Event
Join 3500+ Attendees at FMAS:24 | Africa's Premium Financial Event
Looking to expand your network in #Africa? Join 3500+ attendees at FMAS:24, where online trading, fintech, payments, and crypto meet! Connect with industry leaders and innovators for an unmatched networking experience.
20-22 MAY 2024
Sandton Convention Center, Sandton, South Africa
Register now to secure your spot: https://bit.ly/3JbUpCK
#fmas #fmas24 #fmevents #networking #finance #africa
📣 Stay updated with the latest in finance and trading!
Follow Finance Magnates for news, insights, and event updates across our social media platforms. Connect with us today:
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Looking to expand your network in #Africa? Join 3500+ attendees at FMAS:24, where online trading, fintech, payments, and crypto meet! Connect with industry leaders and innovators for an unmatched networking experience.
20-22 MAY 2024
Sandton Convention Center, Sandton, South Africa
Register now to secure your spot: https://bit.ly/3JbUpCK
#fmas #fmas24 #fmevents #networking #finance #africa
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Follow Finance Magnates for news, insights, and event updates across our social media platforms. Connect with us today:
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Join 3500+ Attendees at FMAS:24 - Africa's Premium Financial Event
Join 3500+ Attendees at FMAS:24 - Africa's Premium Financial Event
Looking to expand your network in #Africa?
Join 3500+ attendees at FMAS:24, where online trading, fintech, payments, and crypto meet! Connect with industry leaders and innovators for an unmatched networking experience.
20-22 MAY 2024
Sandton Convention Center, Sandton, South Africa
Register now to secure your spot: https://bit.ly/3JbUpCK
#fmas #fmas24 #fmevents #networking #finance #africa
Looking to expand your network in #Africa?
Join 3500+ attendees at FMAS:24, where online trading, fintech, payments, and crypto meet! Connect with industry leaders and innovators for an unmatched networking experience.
20-22 MAY 2024
Sandton Convention Center, Sandton, South Africa
Register now to secure your spot: https://bit.ly/3JbUpCK
#fmas #fmas24 #fmevents #networking #finance #africa
Where the Prop Trading Industry Goes from Here | Finance Magnates Podcast
Where the Prop Trading Industry Goes from Here | Finance Magnates Podcast
Explore the tumultuous world of prop trading in this Finance Magnates podcast episode, featuring insights from Head of Axi Select, Greg Rubin.
We're discussing the challenges and shifts caused by MetaQuotes' pivotal decisions affecting MT4 and MT5 users, and how Axi Select offers a unique, realistic path to professional trading, steering clear of traditional prop firm pitfalls.
Tune in for expert analysis on the future of trading and innovative funding models.
The Axi Select programme is only available to clients of AxiTrader Limited. CFDs carry a high risk of investment loss. In our dealings with you, we will act as a principal counterparty to all of your positions. This content is not available for AU, NZ, EU and UK residents. For more information, refer to our Terms of Service. Standard trading fees apply.
This content is provided solely for general informational purposes and should not be construed as financial product advice or an investment recommendation. It has been prepared without considering your personal circumstances.
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Explore the tumultuous world of prop trading in this Finance Magnates podcast episode, featuring insights from Head of Axi Select, Greg Rubin.
We're discussing the challenges and shifts caused by MetaQuotes' pivotal decisions affecting MT4 and MT5 users, and how Axi Select offers a unique, realistic path to professional trading, steering clear of traditional prop firm pitfalls.
Tune in for expert analysis on the future of trading and innovative funding models.
The Axi Select programme is only available to clients of AxiTrader Limited. CFDs carry a high risk of investment loss. In our dealings with you, we will act as a principal counterparty to all of your positions. This content is not available for AU, NZ, EU and UK residents. For more information, refer to our Terms of Service. Standard trading fees apply.
This content is provided solely for general informational purposes and should not be construed as financial product advice or an investment recommendation. It has been prepared without considering your personal circumstances.
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